THIS PROGRAM IS MADE BY MPT TO ENRICH ALL OF OUR DIVERSE COMMUNITIES AND IS MADE POSSIBLE BY THE GENEROUS SUPPORT OF OUR MEMBERS.

THANK YOU.

LIVE FROM MARYLAND PUBLIC TELEVISION, THIS IS "DIRECT CONNECTION" WITH JEFF SALKIN.

*] >> JEFF: GOOD EVENING AND WELCOME TO YOUR "DIRECT CONNECTION."

WE BEGIN TONIGHT WITH DROPPING ANCHORS.

THE BALTIMORE TV STATION IS DONE AWAY WITH THE EVENING NEWS ANCHORS SHAKING UP A FORMAT THAT GOES BACK 80 YEARS.

IS THIS THE FUTURE?

ASKING FOR A FRIEND.

JOINING US ARE LONG TIME BALTIMORE BROADCASTER JAMIE COSTELLO AND LONGER TIME BROADCASTER AND NEWS EXECUTIVE WAYNE LYNCH.

WAYNE, IF I CAN START WITH YOU.

YOU'VE RUN NEWS OPERATIONS IN MAJOR MARKETS YOU'VE TAUGHT AT THE UNIVERSITY OF WASHINGTON APPARENTLY YOU ARE JOINING US FROM THE PACIFIC NORTHWEST OR DEEP SPACE SOMEWHERE.

BUT I IN SETTING THIS UP, I SHOULD CALL UP THIS IMAGE THAT YOU WERE KIND TO SEND OVER FROM THE 1970s WHEN YOU WERE THE MODEL FOR THE RON BERGDY CHARACTER.

DO YOU STILL HAVE THAT SPORT COAT ON NEPTUNE?

>> THEY ARE BACK IN STYLE AND AND I THINK JAMIE USED THAT PATTERN TO DO A POSTER IN THE BASEMENT THAT HE STILL HAS.

BUT, YES, I PICKED THE OUTERSPACE BACKGROUND BECAUSE WARE THAT SURE WHERE THE NEWS BISS IS RIGHT NOW.

IT'S OUT THERE SOMEWHERE AND I DON'T KNOW WHERE IT'S GOING.

MAYBE IT'S APPROPRIATE.

>> Jeff: LET'S TALK ABOUT WHERE IT'S GOING OF.

YOU HAVE BEEN ON THE NEWS SIDE, YOU'VE BEEN ON THE BUSINESS SIDE, THE ACADEMIC SIDE IS WHAT CHANNEL 2 IS DOING IN BALTIMORE IS THERE ANY CHANCE IT'S THE WAVE OF THE FUTURE?

>> WELL, I THINK THAT THE INDUSTRY IS CHANGING VERY RAPIDLY AND I DON'T SEE IT GOING BACKWARDS.

I REALLY DON'T.

SO I THINK BECAUSE ONE COMPANY IS ALREADY TRYING WHAT WMAR-2 IS DOING IN OTHER MARKETS IT HAS, I THINK THE CHANCES OF IT MOVING FORWARD ARE PRETTY GOOD.

WHETHER YOU LIKE IT OR NOT, I DON'T THINK IT IS AN AFTER LANG COMING DOWN THE MOUNTAIN SIDE.

I THINK IT'S SORT OF BECAUSE THIS PARTICULAR COMPANY WHICH WE'RE NOT GOING TO GET INTO TOO HEAVILY THEY ARE TRYING SOMETHING NEW THROWING SOMETHING AT THE WALL HOPE TO GO WILL STICK AND OTHER COMPANIES ARE WATCHING IT CLOSELY TO SEE IF IT DOES ANYTHING.

>> Jeff: FOR PEOPLE WHO HAVEN'T SEEN IT, IT'S BASICALLY, A SERIES OF STORIES SORT OF SMUSHED TOGETHER WITHOUT JAMIE COSTELLO ANCHORMAN OR ANY OTHER PERSON AT THE DESK TELLING YOU OUR NEXT STORY IS WHATEVER AND MAYBE AT THE END SAYING THERE IS AN UPDATE.

IT'S STORY, STORY, STORY.

SO, JAMIE LET YOU TO DEFEND YOUR PROFESSION?

PEOPLE MAY THINK THE TV NEWS ANCHOR IS JUST A MATTER OF READING WORDS OFF A TELEPROMPTER.

THAT IS WHAT IT SAYS.

I MEAN YOUR EXPERIENCE IS YOU WROTE STUFF YOU REPORTED STUFF AN AMBASSADOR FOR THE STATION SUDDEN THAT PROFESSION BE DONE AWAY WITH?

>> ABSOLUTELY NO.

DO YOU GO TO A DELI EXPECTING TO HAVE MEAT?

AND YOU DON'T FIND THE MEAT YOU DON'T SHOP AT THE DELI.

AND BY THE WAY, WAYNE LYNCH HIRED ME ALMOST 40 YEARS AGO SO HE MADE THAT FIRST MISTAKE THAT CHANNEL 2.

BUT HE WAS GREAT.

WAYNE WAS GREAT.

HE WAS A GREAT REPORTER.

AND WHEN HE WAS OUT IN THE COMMUNITY AS ANTIQUES ROAD SHOW KHO*R THE PEOPLE CAME UP TO HIM AND SAID I HAVE ANOTHER STORY THAT IS WHAT GENERATES THE CONTENT.

ANCHORS THEY ARE LIKE THE POINT GUARD AND WHAT THEY DO IS THEY BRING IT ALTOGETHER.

AND WE DON'T HAVE THOSE THREE-HOUR LUNCHES.

WE GO OUT AND REPORT GET INVOLVED IN THE COMMUNITY, COME UP WITH THE STORIES, COME BACK AND WRITE THE STORIES AND PUT THEM ON THE AIR.

WAYNE AND JEFF YOU HAVE TO ADMIT TELEVISION NEEDS CONNECTION.

WE ARE WHEN I FIRST STARTED WE HAD A TWO-PERSON CREW.

PHOTOGRAPHER AND SOMEONE HOLDING THE BOOM MIC FOR AUDIO.

THEN THEY GOT RID OF THE BOOM MICKER AND WE WENT TO MMJ'S WHERE WE DO IT OURSELF WE SHOOT, EDIT AND POST IT'S NOW ALL THIS ALL IN THE PHONE AND THAT IS WHERE WE ARE NOW.

WE DON'T KNOW WHAT THE NEXT STAGE IS GOING TO BE.

>> >> Jeff: I THINK WAYNE IS BEAMED IN AGAIN.

AND WELL, THAT'S A GOOD PLACE TO PICK IT UP.

JAMIE WAS TALKING ABOUT HOW IT'S ONE MAN BAND PHOTOJOURNALISTS AND JAMIE YOU ARE FRIENDS WITH A LOT OF PEOPLE STILL WORKING AT CHANNEL 2 A LOT OF GREAT TALENT THERE.

WAYNE, WHAT IS LOST WHEN THERE IS NO JAMIE ANCHORING THE NEWSCAST?

>> I THINK OUR CONNECTION TO THE OUTER REACHES OF UNIVERSE MAY HAVE FROZEN.

SO WHILE WAYNE REBOOTS, JAMIE LET'S TALK ABOUT THAT THE GREAT ONES THE BALTIMORE MARKET, YOU KNOW, IS JERRY AND AL WASHINGTON.

>> I GREW UP ON JERRY AND GEORGE RODGERS AND WAYNE, OF COURSE.

SCOTT, VINCE WAGLY THE NAMES.

SUSAN AND JACK, ANDY BARR LOU DAVIS YOUR GUY FOR MANY YEARS AT MPT.

THEY WILL ALWAYS BE A PART OF ME BECAUSE I LOVE WATCHING THEM AND CONNECTED WITH ME.

AND NOW I'M GOING TO MISS.

I DON'T KNOW HOW THIS IS GOING TO GO AND EVOLVE.

BUT LIKE WAYNE SAID, EVERYBODY IS WATCHING TO SEE HOW THIS IS GOING TO WORK STHAOR I THINK -- >> Jeff: I THINK IF YOU ARE THE GENERAL MANAGER AND MAKING THAT CALL IT WAS PROBABLY MADE AT CORPORATE HEADQUARTERS YOU ARE CONCEDING YOU WILL NOT BE COMPETITIVE.

YOU ARE GOING TO CONTINUE TO PUT OUT A PRODUCT AND YOU WILL DO IT FOR LESS MONEY, BUT THAT'S NOT A BET ON INCREASING THE RATINGS, I DON'T THINK.

AND THE OTHER POINT, JAMIE IS WHEN YOU LOOK AT HOW PEOPLE ARE GETTING THEIR NEWS TODAY IT'S SHIFTED FROM WHEN YOU FIRST WENT ON THE AIR.

AND A LOT OF WHAT PEOPLE SEE ON SOCIAL MEDIA AND ON THE INTERNET, IS FRANKLY BOLONEY.

SO THE NEED FOR A TRUSTED VOICE, A JERRY AND AL, JIM VANCE DOREEN SOMEBODY LIKE THAT I THINK THERE'S MORE NEED FOR THAT THEN THERE USED TO BE.

>> WE NEED A COMFORT BLANKET.

AND I REMEMBER WHEN WATCHING THE 11:00 NEWS WITH JERRY AND HE WOULD END WITH A FUNNY STORY.

I DON'T CARE BALTIMORE COULD HAVE BEEN BURNING DOWN BUT THAT LAST STORY OF THE NIGHT MADE YOU FEEL LIKE WE ARE GOING TO BE OKAY IF WE CAN HOLD HANDS AND GET THROUGH THE NIGHT.

I TRIED TO EMULATE THAT ON THE AIR WITH WITH CHANNEL 2.

THE BAD NEWS YOU HAVE TO DELIVER BUT YOU GOT TO HOLD THE HAND OF THE PEOPLE WATCHING AND MAKE SURE THEY WILL FEEL BETTER IN THE MORNING IT'S ABOUT COMMUNITY.

JEFF, YOU DO IT AT MPT YOU'VE DONE A GREAT JOB OVER THE YEARS.

>> Jeff: I APPRECIATE THAT.

DIFFERENT ENVIRONMENT BACK IN THE DAY.

YOU THINK ABOUT JERRY TURNER'S RATINGS ON THE 11:00 NEWS AT CHANNEL 13 THIS WON'T MAKE SENSE BUT HE HAD A 70 SHARE AT 11:00 WHICH MEANT THAT FOR LET'S SAY THERE WERE A MILLION TELEVISIONS ON AT THAT HOUR, 700,000 WERE WATCHING JERRY BECAUSE THERE WERE THREE STATIONS DOING NEWS.

IT WAS REALLY NO OTHER WAY TO GET YOUR NEWS AT AT THAT TIME HOUR.

AND THERE WAS NO INTERNET.

>> RIGHT.

YOU DIDN'T WATCH THE NEWS YOU WATCHED JERRY.

YOU WATCHED GORGE GEORGE.

>> Jeff: YOU MENTIONED HOW JERRY LOVED TO END THE SHOW WITH A KICKER ONLY ON THE 11:00 NEWS.

I HAD THE HONOR OF WRITING A COUPLE OF THOSE.

WAY, WAY, WAY BACK IN TIME.

BUT THE WHATEVER NETWORK THEY WERE HAD THE OLYMPICS AT ONE POINT AND IT MEANT THAT SO THE 6:00 NEWS IN ORDER TO THEY HAD TO SHRINK THE NEWS FOR MORE OLYMPICS COVERAGE THEY DID HALF HOUR INSTEAD OF A FULL HOUR WHICH MEANT THEY USED THEIR 11:00 FORMAT WHICH ENDED WITH JERRY'S BEDTIME STORY AND THE JOKE WAS WHEN HE DID THAT AT 6:30 HALF OF BALTIMORE TURNED OUT THE LIGHTS AND WENT TO SLEEP.

>> IT WAS GREAT.

AND THE THING ABOUT IT IS IS THAT THE PEOPLE THAT ARE WORKING MY FRIENDS AT CHANNEL 2, THEY REALLY DIDN'T DESERVE THIS.

AND THEY ARE JUST HOLDING THEIR HEAD UP HIGH AND WONDERING WHAT THE NEXT STAGE OF WHAT THEIR LIFE IS GOING TO BE.

BUT FOR ALL OF US WHO WORKED AT CHANNEL 2 IT'S LIKE MOURNING.

WE WANT TO LAY FLOWERS BECAUSE IT IS A PART OF OUR LIVES.

IT'S THE REASON WE GOT UP AT 2:00 A.M.

TO GO IN AND COVER A SNOWSTORM AND NOT GO HOME FOR DAYS.

TO COVER A TORNADO OR A HURRICANE.

OR TO COVER SOMETHING LIKE COWS 2131 TO BE AT CAMDEN WARDS, SKWRUFR THE SUPER BOWLS WE BROUGHT THE COMMUNITY TOGETHER AND YEAH IT IS A TOUGH LOSS.

WE'LL SEE WHAT THE FUTURE HOLDS, JEFF.

I REMEMBER THE ONE DAY WHEN I KNEW IT WAS CHANGING I A GREAT STORY AND THE NEWS DIRECTOR TOLD ME WE ARE GOING TO PUT IT ON-LINE FIRST INSTEAD OF ON THE AIR.

AND THAT'S THE INTERNET.

AND THAT CHANGED THE WHOLE GAME.

THE WHOLE GAME.

>> Jeff: YOU KNOW I WAS WONDERING ABOUT THAT.

THE NEW FORMAT THERE IS BASICALLY JUST THE PIECES THAT YOU WOULD PUT ON-LINE, MINUS THE ANCHOR INTRO THAT USED TO KNIT *FRT TOGETHER.

SO I MEAN CLEARLY THE INTERNET IS DRIVING THE TRAIN.

AND THE MAIN THING THEY WANT IS THESE PACKAGES WE CALL THEM IN THE BUSINESS AND THEY WANT THEM FOR USE ON-LINE.

>> CHANNEL 2 WAS THE FIRST TO COME UP WITH A THE FIRST AT 5, THE FIRST ONE AT 5:00 NEWS AND NOW, JEFF, YOU ARE OUT THERE AT 5:00 GOING TO OWINGS MILLS LOOK AT EVERYBODY NOT HOME WATCHING.

THE APPOINTMENT VIEWING FOR LOCAL NEWS IS OVER.

AND IT'S SAD THE WAY OF THE WORLD THE WAY OF THE WORLD THAT Mr.

OUR FRIEND OVER THERE, IS ON TOP OF IT RIGHT NOW.

SO I DON'T KNOW WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN IN THE FUTURE THERE, JEFF.

>> Jeff: IS THERE ANYWAY THAT YOU THINK WHAT WE'RE SEEING ON CHANNEL 2 IS A MAYBE INTERMEDIATE STEP TOWARDS ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE NEWS ANCHORS?

BECAUSE MAYBE THAT TRANSITION WE'RE FIRING PEOPLE AND REPLACING THEM WITH A.I.

GENERATED TALENT WILL BE EASIER IF THEY GET RID OF EVERYBODY TO DO WHATEVER THIS CURRENT FORMAT IS AND IMPROVE IT BY ADDING FAKE ANCHORS?

>> WELL, YOU ARE AHEAD OF THE GAME.

I DON'T THINK THEY ARE PROBABLY THINKING THAT RIGHT NOW.

A.I.

WE DON'T KNOW WHAT IS COMING DOWN FOR THAT THAT WILL BE AN INCREDIBLE THING TO SEE.

I DON'T KNOW THAT'S IT.

I DON'T KNOW HOW AND I'M SURE THEY KNOW IF SOMETHING BREAK THERE IS THIS TOWN HOW WILL THEY GET IT ON THE AIR?

SOMETHING LIVE HAPPENS?

HOW ARE THEY GOING TO GET IT ON THE AIR.

I DON'T KNOW THOSE DETAILS.

>> Jeff: ONE OTHER THINGS VIEWERS HAVE NOTICED IN TERMS OF CHANGES IN LOCAL TELEVISION NEWS HAS BEEN THAT SPORTS HAS BEEN DEMOTED.

YOU MENTIONED VINCE BAGLEY, I DON'T KNOW WHAT HE GOT FOUR, FIVE, SIX MINUTES A NIGHT BUT SPORTS HAS BEEN DIMINISHED WEATHER HAS NOT.

YOU SEE BIG TEAMS OF METEOROLOGISTS AT EVERY STATION.

>> NOW YOU ARE GOING DOWN MY ALLEY.

SPORTS UNITES COMMUNITIES.

HIGH SCHOOL, LITTLE LEAGUE, IF YOU PUT A LITTLE LEAGUE GAME ON YOU HAVE THE PARENTS WATCHING THE GRANDS PARENTS WATCHING ALL THE AUNTS AND UNCLES ALL THE FRIENDS.

YOU PUT THE COLLEGES ON SAME THING.

YOU GO THE ORIOLES THE RAVENS THE WINNING WAYS AND I'M TELLING YOU THE SPORTS UNITES A COMMUNITY.

WE SHOULD HAVE IT -- IT SHOULD BE NEWS, WEATHER AND EIGHT HOURS OF VINCE BAGLEY OR SCOTT.

WE HAD SCOTT AND KEITH MILLS TWO LEGENDS ON CHANNEL 2 AT ONE-TIME.

AND EVERYBODY WATCHED.

SATURDAY NIGHT.

>> Jeff: I GOT TIME FOR ONE SENTENCE ON THIS.

WHAT ARE YOU DOING NOW?

YOU'RE DOING EMCEE AND CORPORATE VIDEO?

>> I'M WORKING FOR MY WIFE AND HAD I NOT EMBRACED THE MMJ WORLD OF SHOOTING AND EDITING I WOULDN'T BE WHERE I AM TODAY.

>> Jeff: JAMIE COSTELLO GOT TO ADOPT.

WE APPRECIATE YOUR TIME.

THANK YOU, SIR.

>> THANK YOU, THANK YOU.

>> Jeff: AND WE WILL BE RIGHT BACK.

>> Jeff: YANET AMANUEL HAS RELEASED A NEW REPORT ON POLICE KILLINGS IN MARYLAND.

WE SPOKE ABOUT IT WITH YANET AMANUEL PUBLIC POLICY DIRECTOR FOR THE A.C.L.U.

OF MARYLAND.

>> IT TOOK YEARS OF WORK INVOLVED REVIEWING BODY-CAMERA FOOTAGE, INVESTIGATIVE REPORTS TALKING TO WITNESSES, READING ARTICLES.

AND THAT'S WHAT THE WORK THAT WENTZ NCAA COMPILING THE DATA WE PUBLISHED ALONGSIDE THIS REPORT AND WE THOUGHT IT WAS NECESSARY SO FOLKS COULD SEE THE FULL PICTURE AND BE ABLE TO LOOK AT THESE INDIVIDUAL REPORTS ALONGSIDE OUR RECOMMENDATIONS.

>> Jeff: WHAT IS THE FULL PICTURE?

WHAT ARE YOUR KEY FINDINGS HERE?

>> MAYBE TAKEAWAY IS THAT WE'RE DEALING WITH A SYSTEMIC CRISIS AND NOT JUST A SERIES OF ISOLATED INCIDENCES.

THERE WERE 143 PEOPLE KILLED FROM 2015-2023.

ALL BY POLICE AND NOT A SINGLE ON DUTY POLICE OFFICER HAS BEEN CRIMINALLY CONVICTED.

IF YOU LOOK AT SOME OF THE CASES, YOU MEAN, THE FACTS ARE REALLY THERE THAT IT COULD HAVE BEEN 100% PREVENTSABLE.

INSTEAD OF INSTITUTIONS, LOOKING AT THESE INSTANCES AND TAKING AWAY HOW DO WE PREVENTED THESE FROM HAPPENING IN THE FUTURE THEY SPEND THEIR ENERGY TRYING TO JUSTIFY THE OFFICER'S ACTIONS INSTEAD OF FIGURING OUT TO PREVENTED THIS FROM HAPPENING IN THE FUTURE.

>> Jeff: THOSE ARE TWO DIFFERENT THINGS HOW DO PREVENT THE CASES VERSUS HOW TO CONVICT MORE PEOPLE, I GUESS WHAT I'M SAYING IS SOMETHING MAY NOT RISE TO THE LEVEL OF CRIMINAL RESPONSIBILITY, BUT YOU ARE SAYING IT STILL COULD HAVE BEEN PREVENTED?

>> YES.

WE ARE TALKING ABOUT HALF OF THESE INSTANCES FOLKS IN A MENTAL HEALTH CRISIS OR MEDICAL EMERGENCY AND THOSE SITUATIONS COULD HAVE BEEN HANDLED DIFFERENTLY BY SENDING INDIVIDUALS WHO ARE MENTAL HEALTH SPECIALISTS BETTER TO TRAINED TO HANDLE THE SITUATIONS ALONGSIDE WITH POLICE OFFICERS.

AND SOME OF THESE INSTANCES WE HAVE THE MAJORITY OF THOSE FOLKS UNARMED.

IT DIDN'T HAVE TO END IN VIOLENCE EITHER.

AND WE HAVE EXAMPLES WHERE WHEN THE INDIVIDUAL IS WHITE AND IS ARMED THEY ARE ABLE TO APPREHEND THE PERSON WITH NO USE-OF-FORCE.

BUT BLACK VICTIMS ALSO UNARMED IT ENDS DEADLY.

IT IS TWO SITUATIONS BOTH CAN BE PREVENTED AND ALSO THERE SHOULD BE ACCOUNTABILITY TO PREVENT OR DISCOURAGE OTHERS FROM ENGAGING IN SIMILAR USES OF FORCE.

>> Jeff: AND RACIAL DISPARITIES ARE EVIDENT ACROSS THIS DATABASE.

>> ABSOLUTELY.

WE ARE TALKING ABOUT BLACK PEOPLE MAKEUP 31% OF MARYLAND'S POPULATION BUT 64% OF INDIVIDUALS WHO ARE KILLED BY POLICE.

AND WE'RE TALKING ABOUT 71% -- 78% OF INDIVIDUALS WHO ARE BLACK AND UNARMED WHO END UP IN THE FATAL OUTCOMES.

>> Jeff: WHERE DO THE CASES TEND TO HAPPEN?

YOU ARE LOOKING ACROSS THE STATE OF MARYLAND?

>> YEAH, LOOKING AT NO, ACROSS THE ENTIRE STATE OF MARYLAND THEY HAPPEN IN MONTGOMERY COUNTY, BALTIMORE CITY, PRINCE GEORGE'S AND DOWN IN THE EASTERN SHORE AS WELL.

SO WE'RE LOOKING AT ACROSS THE STATE PROBLEM BUT THERE ARE HEAVY CONCENTRATION AND INCIDENTS HAPPENING IN IN POPULATIONS MAJORITY BLACK.

SNARE AND HOW OFTEN IS IT -- >> Jeff: HOW OFTEN IS IT THE POLICE SHOOTING SOMEBODY AS OPPOSED TO A VEHICLE PURSUIT OR SOME SORT OF RESTRAINT?

>> SO ACCORDING TO OUR DATABASE BETWEEN 2015 AND 2023, THERE WAS 128 PEOPLE WHO DIED BY GUNSHOT WOUND.

AND EIGHT PEOPLE KILLED BY TASERS, INCLUDING TWO CASES THAT INVOLVED BOTH A TASER AND PHYSICAL RESTRAINT AND SIX CASES INVOLVING PHYSICAL RESTRAINT.

AND IT'S ALSO IMPORTANT TO NOTE ALTHOUGH THESE DEATHS ARE NOT INCLUDED IN OUR TOTAL COUNT, IS THAT DURING THE SAME TIME PERIOD, 45 PEOPLE DIED AS A RESULT OF 39 POLICE PURSUITS INCLUDING 10 BYSTANDERS AND ONE INFANT.

>> Jeff: LET ME COME BACK TO THE MENTAL HEALTH ISSUES FOR A SECOND.

BECAUSE THERE WAS A RECENT CASE WHERE THE RESPONDING OFFICERS IT WAS A MAN WITH A KNIFE RESPONDING OFFICERS WERE NOT TOLD I BELIEVE THAT IT WAS AN INDIVIDUAL WITH KNOWN MENTAL HEALTH ISSUES HAVING SOME SORT OF CRISIS.

IS THAT A POTENTIAL AREA FOR IMPROVEMENT?

>> ABSOLUTELY.

I THINK WHEN PEOPLE ARE MAKING A CALL FOR HELP THEY CAN BETTER DESCRIBE WHAT THE SITUATION IS GOING ON.

FOR MOST CASES THEY ARE SOMEBODY WITH A MENTAL HEALTH CRISIS AND INFORMED THIS IS SOMEBODY SEEKING MEDICAL EMERGENCY.

ONE OF OUR RECOMMENDATIONS IS TO IMPROVE HOW WE HANDLE THESE SITUATIONS BY EVEN IF YOU SUSPECT SOMEONE MIGHT BE IN A CRISIS SENDING ALONG WITH SOMEONE WHO IS AN EXPERT TO ASSESS THE SITUATION.

>> Jeff: AND THE WAKE OF FREDDIE GRAY AND GEORGE FLOYD DO YOU FEEL LIKE SOME PROGRESS HAS BEEN MADE IN THAT AREA?

>> THAT'S IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION NOT NOT NEAR WHERE WE NEED TO BE.

THE PASSAGE OF ANTOINE'S LAW AND THE POLICE ACCOUNTABILITY LAW, WE HAVE MADE STEPS FOR GREATER TRANSPARENCY WITH ALLOWING US TO SEE AS FAR AS THE OUTCOME OF THESE MISCONDUCT CASES.

AND MORE COMMUNITY INVOLVEMENT IN THE DISCIPLINARY PROCESS BUT IT'S STILL NOT ENOUGH.

WE STILL HAVE 12 PEOPLE WHO HAVE BEEN KILLED BY POLICE THIS YEAR.

WE HAVEN'T SEEN A DECREASE OR ACCOUNTABILITY BECAUSE TO DATE NO ON DUTY POLICE OFFICER HAS BEEN HELD ACCOUNTABLE.

WE ARE URGING FOR GREATER COMMUNITY OVERSIGHT AND CONTROL OF THE POLICE DISCIPLINE PROCESS.

WHAT THAT LOOKS LIKE IS THESE POLICE ACCOUNTABILITY BOARDS HAVE INDIVIDUAL SUBPOENA POWERS AND OUTCOME OF DISCIPLINE TO ACTUALLY HOLD THE OFFICERS ACCOUNTABLE.

>> Jeff: THE MARYLAND ATTORNEY GENERAL'S OFFICE HAS GOTTEN ADDITIONAL POWER THE SOLE POWER TO INVESTIGATE POLICE INVOLVED DEATHS AND MAKE A DETERMINATION WHETHER TO PROSECUTE.

IT USED TO BE DONE AT THE COUNTY PROSECUTOR LEVEL.

I DON'T BRIEF THERE HAVE BEEN PROSECUTIONS YET.

BUT EVERYTHING'S BEEN PRETTY THOROUGHLY LOOKED AT.

WHAT DO WE TAKEAWAY FROM THAT?

>> I THINK WE'RE STILL DEALING WITH PEOPLE WHO ARE INTIMATELY CLOSE TO THE SYSTEM.

YOU STILL HAVE STATE PROSECUTORS INVOLVED A LOT OF THE INVESTIGATORS ARE WITH THE POLICE DEPARTMENT WE NEED INDEPENDENTS INVESTIGATIONS TO TRUST THE OUTCOME OF THESE INVESTIGATIONSES.

IF WE DID THAT WE WOULD HAVE MORE ADEQUATE FINDINGS AND THE PUBLIC WOULD BE ABLE TO TRUST THE OUTCOME OF THOSE FINDINGS AS WELL.

>> Jeff: WHAT DOES WORK IN REDUCING POLICE INVOLVED DEATHS?

THERE'S OFFICERS CARRYING TASERS, SO LESS LETHAL OR NONLETHAL FORCE, DEESCALATION TRAINING THAT SORT OF THING.

IS THERE SOMETHING THE A.C.L.U.

WOULD LIKE TO SEE MORE OR LESS OF?

>> WE SEE DEATHS WITH TASERS WE HAVE AN INDIVIDUAL KILLED WITH A TASER IN THE MIDDLE OF HAVING A HEART ATTACK.

SO THAT'S NOT EFFECTIVE EITHER.

WHAT WE ARE RECOMMENDING AND HAVE BEEN PURSUING FOR THE LAST FEW YEARS IS STRENGTHENING THE POLICE ACCOUNTABILITY BOARDS WITH THE INDEPENDENT POWERS.

UNTIL COMMUNITY HAS GREATER CONTROL OF THE DISCIPLINARY PROCESS AND PEOPLE ARE HELD ACCOUNTABLE THERE IS NO WAY TO DISCOURAGE OFFICERS FROM BEING INVOLVED IN THESE USE-OF-FORCE INSTANCES.

AND ADDITIONALLY OTHER THINGS WE CAN DO PASS SAFER TRAFFIC STOPS BILL WHICH WOULD NO LONGER ALLOW NONEMERGENCY SITUATIONS TO BE THE REASON THAT POLICE OFFICERS PULL SOMEONE OVER AS A PRIMARY REASON STORE THE STOP.

THINGS LIKE TINTS, OR EXPIRED REGISTRATION THAT SHOULDN'T BE THE PRIMARY REASON FOR THE STOP.

THOSE ARE THINGS WE CAN DO TO REDUCE THE UNNECESSARY ENCOUNTERS.

BECAUSE WITH THIS REPORT SHOWS IS THAT ENCOUNTER ALONE CAN BE DANGEROUS FOR A BRACK MALE AS WELL AS PEOPLE IN -- BLACK MALE AS WELL AS PEOPLE IN CRISIS.

>> Jeff: BALTIMORE CITY POLICE DEPARTMENT HAS BEEN UNDER A FEDERAL COURT CONSENT DECREE FOR A LONGTIME NOW.

IS THAT SOMETHING THAT HAS HAD A POSITIVE IMPACT?

>> I CAN'T SAY I'VE SEEN THAT UNFORTUNATELY.

WE STILL HAVE POLICE OFFICERS THAT HAVE NOT BEEN HELD ACCOUNTABLE.

CURRENTLY THE TRIAL BOARD IS BACKED UP WITH 71 COMPLAINTS.

SO THERE'S STILL ISSUES THAT WE'RE SEEING WITH THE POLICE ACCOUNTABILITY.

AND WE'RE STILL WITNESSING ALSO PEOPLE DYING IN THESE POLICE ENCOUNTERS AS WELL.

UNTIL WE SEE AN ACTUAL DECREASE I CAN'T SAY WE'VE SEEN ANY PROGRESS.

>> Jeff: I READ SOMEWHERE SINCE GEORGE FLOYD, FREDDIE GRAY AND THE SURPRISED ME THE NUMBER OF POLICE RELATED DEATHS IS REPORTED TO BE UP NOT DOWN?

>> YEAH, UNFORTUNATELY THAT'S WHAT WE'RE SEEING IN MARYLAND AS WELL.

I THINK THAT IS BECAUSE THERE'S BEEN SOME SLIGHT PROGRESS AS FAR AS REFORMS DID BUT THEY DIDN'T GO ALL THE WAY OR ENOUGH TO SAVE PEOPLE'S LIVES.

SO THERE'S MORE WORK TO DO IN THIS AREA.

>> Jeff: AND BEFORE WE GO, FOR PEOPLE IN THE AUDIENCE WHO MIGHT BE CONCERNED ABOUT GETTING PULLED OVER ON A DARK HIGHWAY WITH EXPIRED TAGS OR WHATEVER, WHAT IS YOUR ADVICE?

>> PEOPLE KNOW WHAT THEIR RIGHTS ARE.

THAT THEY KEEP THEIR HANDS ON THE STEERING WHEEL AND ARE VERY CLEAR WHEN THEY ARE REACHING FOR THEIR REGISTRATION AND STUFF LIKE THAT SO OFFICERS DO NOT ASSUME THEY ARE REACHING FOR SOMETHING.

AND ALSO DOCUMENT ANY IMPROPER INTERACTIONS AND REPORT THEM TO US OR OTHER AGENCIES SO THAT WE CAN MAKE SURE WE'RE KEEPING TRACK AND MAKING SURE THERE IS ACCOUNTABILITY WHERE THERE'S AVAILABILITY.

>> Jeff: YANET AMANUEL OF THE MARYLAND A.C.L.U., WE APPRECIATE YOUR TIME.

THANKS VERY MUCH.

>> THANK YOU.

>> Jeff: AND THAT IS "DIRECT CONNECTION" FOR THIS WEEK.

WE'RE BACK FRIDAY WITH THE LATEST ON MARYLAND POLITICS ON "STATE CIRCLE".

NOW FOR ALL OF US AT MPT THANK YOU FOR WATCHING AND HAVE A GOOD NIGHT.

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